A discussion, an announcement and no links.

First up, if you haven't already, then please go and subscribe to Ryan K Lindsay's newsletter here. It'll make the rest of this newsletter make infinitely more sense (no guarantee, though). 

As mentioned last week Ryan and I did a brief discussion on the writer/editor relationship as well as detailing some of our own working practices and thoughts on it all. The first part ran in the last edition of Ryan's newsletter and the second, final part runs here this week. 

So, here we go...

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RKL: Oh, yeah, the push back is a fun one. Even on work-for-hire stuff, where I know, I’m the hired tool, not the owner nor directive drive, I still want to push back from time to time.

 

The trick is to step back and know when the editor is right or not. In my experience and opinion, they often are. Especially because the great editors are usually just finding things that don’t quite work to their best. They aren’t trying to drop in a better scene and rewriting every damn line. They are telling you when something just needs that level up when something is falling flat because of one small reason. This is all something you do exceptionally well. You call a spade a spade and it lets me know when something isn’t at 100% yet. And that’s important to know.

 

But even with you, sometimes I’ll ignore or only halfway push through one of your edits. Sometimes there are moments/things you just really want to make it through. They are usually the small things. Gigantic sequences of huge character moments that fall flat are usually the darlings you’ve gotta kill. But if it’s just something to the side, not a major plot hinge, and I really love it, that’s when I’ll fight for it.

 

With the big properties, there are always things I’m willing to fight over. I’ll take 95% of the edits in the first round, sometimes [often], but if I’ve pushed back twice against an editor on the same note, they usually know I want it. Hell, sometimes I’ll even flat out state that I’ll take a shot on two other edits where I’m 50/50 if it’ll let me keep the real important thing to me as a pay-off.

 

But those really are usually small things. Whenever you’ve suggested something big, you’ve come with a reason for why you think the original thing isn’t working. If a character reveal isn’t paying off, it’s because of the setup and/or pacing, and you’ll call that and suggest other possibilities. I don’t see that as getting your grubby mitts on my precious story, it’s more just using your knowledge of structure and narrative to inform stuff I’m usually too close to with my heart to really count out.

 

Once you and I both know the characters, and their arcs, and why they matter, I find this works well - which is why we hash that stuff out early and in relative detail.

 

Do you think there could be times where an editor might not align with what the story is going to become, or what the creators want to do with it, and in that instance is it a grit your teeth and take it moment, or should an editor bounce off a project? I know as a writer, I only want to write stories that matter to me, so is that the same for you on the editing side?

 

DH: I can imagine there might be situations like that, but it's a difficult one to parse as to whether one should bounce from the project. As an editor, we're kind of stewards of the story, but ultimately the direction of the story falls to the original creators. There may be moments where a creator and an editor may not align.

 

I think the decision to bounce will come down to the creators involved. Can they see past the differences? Can the editor quiet his internal dissent and get on with trying to make the story the best it can be given the limits they feel themselves under?

 

The more I write it out and think about it, the more it seems the best decision for all involved for a parting of the ways. This kind of feeds into where an editor sees themselves in the creative hierarchy.

 

Sometimes, myself, I kind of feel like an imposter in there, messing with other people's toys and ambitions. It's hard to reconcile that with impressing my own thoughts and angles on things sometimes. Like who am I to futz about with all that?

 

I guess, this kind of links in with what I said above about editors being the 'stewards' of the story. Am I on the money with this metaphor? How do you see it?

 

RKL: It’s funny, because there’s that initial response where I feel like the editor is there to do their job, help out, and if the project isn’t completely their jam, then they can still do their job. But then I instantly know that’s silly. If a letterer doesn’t agree with a project, they shouldn’t have to letter over it. That’s a choice they can make. A colourist doesn’t have to depict colour on a scene they morally don’t believe in.

 

You can work on a book that’s maybe not exactly your taste - I wrote a ‘My Little Pony’ issue and did it just fine despite it being new to me - but we only get so many hours to express ourselves before we die. I’d hate to go out early writing a furry snuff comic because the pay was decent, but I hated the work. So I wouldn’t want anyone else being stuck in that situation either.

 

On the thread of editing what you like, what’s the stuff about editing you’ve enjoyed the most, so far? Doing one-shots, planning multimedia, dialogue thoughts?

 

DH: I think the thing that I've enjoyed the most is...finding how much I enjoy it. Which sounds like a bit of a cop-out, but it's true. It's not something I set out to do and I still have my own writing projects in various stages of production, so to find this whole other aspect amongst the #makecomics creative structure that I enjoy has been fantastic.

 

Digging down a bit deeper, I'd say my favourite aspect of editing is that specific moment where there's a nice symbiosis between myself and the writer, a good bit of push and pull. I suggest something, the writer goes away and tinkers and comes back that takes my suggestion on board but with their own spin on it. We already touched on it briefly earlier, but the ending on Beautiful Canvas is a prime example. It's such a hard balance to strike, so when it all comes up Milhouse, it's a joy to behold.

 

Okay, so to close this out, what are *your* favourite parts of working with an editor?

 

RKL: It’s probably after the fact when you look back and realise how well things have come together. When you can point the great moments of the story and you know which editorial prompts or discussions they stemmed from. It’s akin to looking at your kid and knowing they’re amazing because of the balance in parenting they get.

 

I mean, if your kid had three parents because the artist is also certainly a huge part of that. So are colourists - is making comics like Full House? Probably.

 

Although another thing I’ve enjoyed is when the back and forth goes live, and an honest to goodness discussion erupts in semi-real time on a Google Doc Comment thread. That fervour of bouncing ideas and leveling each other up, and getting somewhere you could only go by crawling onto the shoulders of someone else and leaping up is exhilarating. It’s this foaming water of ideas and open attitudes and in the end, I feel better armed to create the story. Because, and this is key to me, the breaking story part is communal. I love the editor and artist up in that grill, but once it’s time to write, I wanna get solitary. I like writing script pages with just me, a coffee, and some tunes. I don’t think I could ever co-write on the reg, but I love banging the story around the room with an editor and when that’s happened in the past, man, it’s felt glorious.

 

I can also flip that and admit that the worst part of not having an editor is the thought that maybe you missed a spot. You didn’t see an avenue to take, you didn’t push yourself further. You let yourself get off at the first station that looked familiar because it was easy. I don’t like that feeling, which is why I’ve dragged you along for every possible gig I’ve gotten these last few years.

 

I say it to nascent creators all the time: they should get an editor. Or just a really good critical friend. You don’t need to necessarily hire someone, though doing so is a boss move, but you need to expose your story to a little sunlight before you’ve gone too far, or before you’ve abandoned it. Get an editor, take the harsh notes, learn. It’s the only way you’ll get better, and we could all stand to get a little better, every day, in every way.

Lon Eisley is a hitwoman hired to kill a small child a few days after discovering her girlfriend pregnant. In a bold declaration of uncertainty, she saves the boy and hits the road, despire the fact her boss clearly wanted him dead for a reason. This warped crime dystopia delves into the emotional dichotomy of creator/destroyer as Lon tries to connect the two very different worlds she now inhabits. From Sami Kivela (Chum) & Ryan K Lindsay (Negative Space, DC Writers Workshop) comes a gonzo tale of personal discovery, animal/hybrid hit troupes, and reactive pyrokinesis.  

I was lucky enough to be the editor on this project and it's been a journey and a half to see it go from a seed of an idea to finding a home at one of my favourite comic book publishers with a creative team to die for. 

I've been involved in a number of projects now with Sami on art over the last few years and it's been a true pleasure and joy to watch his work grow and evolve. With BC I'd say Sami has leveled up and Ryan has truly given him a toy box in which he can go just go full out gonzo. That, coupled with Triona Farrell's colours is a sight to behold. You'll see. 

I also don't think it's remiss of me to say that Ryan has also upped his writing game with this one. He and I were chatting about Philip K Dick recently. We spoke about how PKD made you care about the characters amidst the insanity and disjointed worlds. I think Ryan has achieved something similar here. Amid the fire, chaos and animal hybrid hit teams you will *care* about Lon Eisley and her burgeoning family. 

Anyway, you'll be hearing more about this in the coming months as its June 2017 release nears. 

Here's a Christian Ward variant cover to close out this segment.


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No links as I've gone on long enough this week, so maybe a bit of a bumper links section next week? 

Until then...